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by dunmunro
Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:40 am
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.
Replies: 61
Views: 544

Re: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.

Alberto Virtuani wrote:
Of course in his letters to Roskill, Tovey said exactly so.


Bye, Alberto


He didn't. Please show us the letter where Tovey states that a weather forecast was actually an order from D. Pound for KGV to R.O.O.F. on the shores of France, under the very noses of the Luftwaffe.
by dunmunro
Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:17 am
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.
Replies: 61
Views: 544

Re: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.

Dunmunro wrote: "Tovey was sent the weather for the Bay of Biscay because that's where the Germans had their French bases, including dozens, if not hundreds of Luftwaffe strike aircraft." Hi Duncan, why was this message sent only to the C.inC. HF and not broadcasted to everybody as the ot...
by dunmunro
Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:43 am
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.
Replies: 61
Views: 544

Re: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.

Next we'll be reading tea leaves... Tovey was sent the weather for the Bay of Biscay because that's where the Germans had their French bases, including dozens, if not hundreds of Luftwaffe strike aircraft. Knowledge of the weather in that area was a vital asset for Tovey. As I've explained Churchill...
by dunmunro
Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:29 pm
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.
Replies: 61
Views: 544

Re: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.

There was considerable time lag in preparing, coding, transmitting, receiving, and decoding messages and then passing them on. It is obvious now, and would have been obvious then, that the 0009b message and the 0050b message passed each other in transit, and so there was no need for a reply by Tovey...
by dunmunro
Tue Jan 16, 2018 7:34 pm
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.
Replies: 61
Views: 544

Re: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.

Hello everybody, @ Dunmunro, what I am directing everybody toward to is that we were all searching for a message which contained on it a clear reference to the French coast, ... the " shore of French ", ... the Bay of Biscay, ... toward Brest, ... something like that directed from the Adm...
by dunmunro
Tue Jan 16, 2018 6:40 pm
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.
Replies: 61
Views: 544

Re: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.

Hello everybody, @ Herr Nillson, Yes, ... that seems obvious to me as well at first look, ... even if it is coming from that level Officer ... :shock: ... and not from the Duty Met. Officer that was issuing that info every 12 hours on regular base, ... But the real question is why from him at that ...
by dunmunro
Mon Jan 15, 2018 7:36 pm
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.
Replies: 61
Views: 544

Re: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.

Churchill made mistakes when writing his histories but he was still bound by the Official Secrets Act. He would not have made reference to a signal that had been "expunged" at his own request or acquiescence. Churchill was referring to the 1137B message and he simply got the timing wrong.
by dunmunro
Mon Jan 15, 2018 7:25 pm
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.
Replies: 61
Views: 544

Re: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.

Hi All, May I ask how it would be possible to expunge a signal that had been transmitted via the airwaves so that every ship in the fleet, shore station, and even your enemy has picked up? Wouldnt the very nature of the repossessions of all those written signals on every ship and shore station arou...
by dunmunro
Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:56 pm
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.
Replies: 61
Views: 544

Re: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.

P-J, in B.S.5, reproduces the 27May 1137b signal verbatim in a footnote on page 34. No mention about the "shores of France" or wording to that effect. P-J also states that the signal was sent after Bismarck was sunk, but before it was known by the Admiralty. This is the same Admiralty whic...
by dunmunro
Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:37 am
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.
Replies: 61
Views: 544

Re: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.

Signals are recorded by every ship that that intercepts the radio transmission. Dozens of ships and even RCN radio stations in Canada would have recorded a message ordering "...KGV to pursue Bismarck to the shores of France..." or words to that effect, yet the only source for it is Tovey'...
by dunmunro
Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:34 am
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.
Replies: 61
Views: 544

Re: The KGV and Adm fuel signals on May 26 and 27.

Signals are recorded by every ship that that intercepts the radio transmission. Dozens of ships and even RCN radio stations in Canada would have recorded a message ordering "...KGV to pursue Bismarck to the shores of France..." or words to that effect, yet the only source for it is Tovey's...
by dunmunro
Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:27 pm
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: The Court Martial for the Denmark Strait
Replies: 946
Views: 20675

Re: The Court Martial for the Denmark Strait

Hello All, According to Kennedy: Sometime during the night of 26th May, Winston Churchill, not then knowing the enemy was crippled beyond repair, became obsessed with the idea that Bismarck must be sunk at whatever cost to our ships. He therefore drafted or had drafted for him the following signal ...
by dunmunro
Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:40 pm
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: Wake-Walker : To engage or not to engage ?
Replies: 83
Views: 1024

Re: Wake-Walker : To engage or not to engage ?

As requested here is the relevant Admiralty War Diary entries for operations against Bismarck. I believe I have included all relevant pages: http://www.sfu.ca/~dmunro/images/Bismarckops.pdf note that while the war diary often included important radio signals it does not contain all signals. Here is...
by dunmunro
Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:37 am
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: Wake-Walker : To engage or not to engage ?
Replies: 83
Views: 1024

Re: Wake-Walker : To engage or not to engage ?

Hello everybody, @ Dunmunro, I like to have your opinion about Kpt H. Brinkmann note on the PG battle map where he wrote to have received at 05:55 from " Flotte ", so from Adm Lutjens ( Flottenchef ) the target selection. This text you can read : Von Flotte : Auf den Gegner am weitesten l...
by dunmunro
Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:08 am
Forum: Bismarck General Discussion
Topic: Wake-Walker : To engage or not to engage ?
Replies: 83
Views: 1024

Re: Wake-Walker : To engage or not to engage ?

As requested here is the relevant Admiralty War Diary entries for operations against Bismarck. I believe I have included all relevant pages:

http://www.sfu.ca/~dmunro/images/Bismarckops.pdf

note that while the war diary often included important radio signals it does not contain all signals.

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