Naval History Forums

Hi Macej, I see your points, and I agree on the purpose of ship and possible war scenario that affect the choice of a design. No modern battleship sustained a heavy gunnery punishment as Bismarck did, so it's difficult to judge who is best. Question is not how much was needed to sink her, but how m...

Armour/not armour is not so simple. American STS used for deck protection sometimes, but was „construction steel” were tested with Tirpitz plates. Were slight better than German Britiss Ducol steel were slight inferior. Say was 90% that of Tirpitz. So instead of 32 You have 29 mm. Dismiss? British ...

Modernized Kirishima was not "modern". Sorry Lutzow - possibly. But was there any torpedo hit? And it is not best exaple, as Derrfilinger had that slope, if I'm not mistaken. But all those are not so revelant. I'm repeating in various places (possibly not here yet) that there is not "...

In case of sinking battleships by gunfire alone I hardly find anyone (modern when sunk) if magazines not detonated.
Some Russians ships were sunk this way on tsuschima battle but other examples?

Maciej wrote: "As mentioned more early combined protection of belt + slope was very unlikely. But detonations inside hull even above main armour deck could not be ignored. Bismarck was destroyed by exactly this form of detonations (+ hits on turrets, superstructures and so on). Who cares if re...

I have always liked the Vanguard. The old 15" twins were good weapons and the Vanguard included many improvements based on war experience with the KGVs. Vanguard was also the first British warship built using extensive electric arc welding. And I alway hate Vanguard. I could see some of its ad...

Could You give data from live tests? I have boxes and boxes of documents. Unfortunately, because of my present circumstances they are in storage and they are not handy. Nonetheless, if I recall correctly the British study that found that no British battleship gun could defeat more than about 5-inch...

Hi Maciej, is the Bismarck IZ diagram you posted above referred to the KGV 14" or to the British 15" gun ? The title says 15" but then you speak about KGV guns.... Hi. Bismarck protection is against 15" British guns using Cardonald shells with "new gun" muzzle velocity...

If we thrust Nathan Okun research, IZ graphs should be more or less like this https://www.dropbox.com/s/q3mnjp6o1efz4ld/Bismarck_vs_Vanguard.jpg?dl=0 and on the same picture Bismarck, Vanguard and modernized Hood (after full modernization that never happen) https://www.dropbox.com/s/5f6xx96w08nwjuc/...

British 14" shell falls at 18.2 degrees and 476m/s at 18km. According to navweaps.com But it is for 2400 fs muzzle velocity, so with considerably worn out guns. PoW guns were new, and some of them had measured MV even higher than nominal new. On warships1 board Phill Golin put some time ago ex...

History turns circes. In 70thies of XIX century in Barnaby era, British build battleships with AoN scheme. The only real thred was heavy AP shot/shell so logic was quite simple. In early 90-thies of XIX century British recognized increased performance of heavy guns, and the same time thred from medi...

In terms of firepower the Bismarck was more powerful. Its 15" guns were more modern than those used by Vanguard. The barrels were significantly longer which creates greater muzzle velocity. This translates into greater belt armour penetration and greater range sans supercharges. Supercharges w...

But Bismarck had better compartmentation, doesn't she? If so does that mean that she was harder to sink than Vanguard with the compartmention offsetting the advantages that Vanguard has, to say deeper belt ? Maybe Bismarck also had a better armor scheme below waterline to her advantage? I'm not so ...

I wonder if a more powerful main armament could be installed on Vanguard. So with the TDSs being equal Bismarck should have had the better overall protection. In short - Yes. Vanguard was not what Royal Navy want, but what was possible with existing limitations. British wanted Lions (A bit shorter ...

Thank You. I don't know why I thought that centeline bulkhead existed. Memory could be false.