Bismarck firing procedures at DS

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Alberto Virtuani
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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by Alberto Virtuani » Tue Oct 09, 2018 2:13 pm

Hello everybody,
Wadinga wrote: " it would be difficult to say whether Bismarck steered west for five, four or three minutes..."
No, it is very easy, looking at the PoW salvo plot, to conclude that Bismarck was NEVER on a more westerly course than 220° at ANY time between 5:56 and 6:00, because on any other more westerly course she could not have closed the range to PoW by almost 5000 yards in 4 minutes.

Wadinga wrote: "Your requirement for personal mano-a-mano combat and victory at all costs by any means, over "loosers" mean you could not let anybody else have the last word"
It's not my fault if the poor Mr.Wading has said an enormity (only to try to deny the facts shown in the film), if he was left alone by everybody and if now he is too arrogant to admit his error. I understand his difficulty, but it would be more dignifying to admit the defeat, or at least to shut-up like other "timid" (but insulting) posters have "wisely" done. :kaput:
I cannot be blamed just because I do not accept an enormity !

However, I appreciate the fact that he knows very well what this defeat means for his denial of the Bismarck firing analysis and RoF.... :D


The final (I hope...) conclusion is that the 1990 map is proven WRONG and Mr.Wadinga has to find another one, if he still wants to counter Antonio's one. Full Stop.


Bye, Alberto
"It takes three years to build a ship; it takes three centuries to build a tradition" (Adm.A.B.Cunningham)

"There's always a danger running in the enemy at close range" (Adm.W.F.Wake-Walker)

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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by northcape » Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:46 pm

alecsandros wrote:
Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:11 am
northcape wrote:
Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:03 pm
I simply stress out the naive (and wrong) approach to interpretation of historical evidences as done by A&A, which they disguise as a "scientific" method.
Feel free to apply it and present the results here.
"How to recognize an internet troll? One of the many indications is the sudden and unrelated change of subject if challenged."

The subject is that A&A confuse facts and their interpretation of the facts.

The subject is not if somebody else wants to do the same nonsense, e.g. using naive and non-scientific methods to create a map with a degree of detail for which no data exist.

Troll on.

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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by alecsandros » Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:13 pm

northcape wrote:
Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:46 pm

"How to recognize an internet troll? One of the many indications is the sudden and unrelated change of subject if challenged."
What change of subject ?
Have you understood the proposition ? Are you aware you are ignoring years of debates , interjecting with a "method" which you claim HADN'T been used, despite the fact that you have no idea what and how had been discussed from 2014 until today ?
And YOU name other people "trolls" ... ?

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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by Alberto Virtuani » Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:48 pm

Hi Alec,
I doubt this "genius" (http://www.kbismarck.org/forum/viewtopi ... ese#p79977) can understand any of your questions... :think:

He is just an exalted and ignorant hooligan (a "fact", not an "interpretation", as per above link, where he blindly supported an error that was then (fairly) admitted by his own author http://www.kbismarck.org/forum/viewtopi ... 570#p80007 but never yet by him :lol: ).


Bye, Alberto
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"There's always a danger running in the enemy at close range" (Adm.W.F.Wake-Walker)

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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by dunmunro » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:58 am

Alberto Virtuani wrote:
Mon Oct 08, 2018 7:03 am



Back however to the Bismarck track and firing, it is clear that Mr.Wadinga has been left alone by all his co-deniers with his theory that the correct battlemap is the 1990 one, published in the last edition of the Baron's book.

Yeah, how could a battlemap drawn by two of the actual gunnery officers aboard Bismarck and PE possibly be accurate?

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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by Antonio Bonomi » Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:27 am

Hello everybody,

as usual, an " hooligan/denier " with poor competence and knowledge about what he is talking about jumped in trying to defend what cannot be defended by anybody, ... simply because it is absolutely incorrect as it simply shows, ... given what we have today available as evidence.

He wrote :
Yeah, how could a battle map drawn by two of the actual gunnery officers aboard Bismarck and PE possibly be accurate?
It is an incorrect statement obviously, because the Baron never made that map that was made only by Paul Schmalenbach.

It is enough to look for reference and confirmation to the Jochen Brennecke 1960 book Schlachtschiff Bismarck, ... where it was printed, ... before Schmalenbach used it again on 1971 for his Prinz Eugen warship profile book, ... long before the Baron went back ( ??? diplomatically ??? ) re-utilizing it on his 1990 second edition book ( :shock: ), ... after having used the most correct and available one ( the 1980 one ) made ( still with Paul Schmalenbach starting the map correction on his 1978 one ) by using both the Prinz Eugen official battle map and the PoW correct track become available too, ... looking and checking the photos and film that became available meanwhile, ... as clearly explained on the map caption itself by Paul Schmalenbach ( guess why :wink: ), ... just as it must be.

Brennecke_1960_map_03.jpg
Brennecke_1960_map_03.jpg (59.59 KiB) Viewed 386 times
Brennecke_book_ISBN_dates_03.jpg
Brennecke_book_ISBN_dates_03.jpg (42.72 KiB) Viewed 386 times


No accurate map can be made about this battle disregarding the Prinz Eugen original track as well as the PoW original one.

It was enough to work on it following Paul Schmalenbach own evolution of this battle map creation, with a minimum historical research attitude.

But I have already explained all those maps evolution to everybody time ago ( 2 years ago ) on this thread, here :

http://www.kbismarck.org/forum/viewtopi ... 195#p68342

and here :

http://www.kbismarck.org/forum/viewtopi ... 240#p68500

Some of the " hooligan/deniers " know about all this since the 2003/2004 long discussion with R. Winklareth on this forum too.

Never for one single second that map had a single chance to be a value add part into a today ( 2018 ) historical discussion about this battle map.

It is a loosing discussion example since the beginning of it as I have explained long time ago, ... and it only show a really poor competence and knowledge by who is supporting it, … together with his real intention by using it in the way it is done today.

This once again demonstrate, ... just like on other discussions, ... like on the Court Martial threat and the Norfolk bearings/distance, ... another miserable and pathetic defeat received by the " hooligan/deniers ", ... while they are unsuccesfully trying to discredit in any way they can, … somebody that only wants to work on an historical re-construction.

Bye Antonio
In order to honor a soldier, we have to tell the truth about what happened over there. The whole, hard, cold truth. And until we do that, we dishonor her and every soldier who died, who gave their life for their country. ( Courage Under Fire )

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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by Alberto Virtuani » Wed Oct 10, 2018 8:06 am

Hello everybody,
Dunmunro wrote: "Yeah, how could a battlemap drawn by two of the actual gunnery officers aboard Bismarck and PE possibly be accurate?"
Yeah, after a full week, finally a hooligan/denier has found the courage to implicitly join Mr.Wadinga's speculation (just when the latter has given up his impossible fight)... :think:


If this means he is suggesting Bismarck was on course 270° at any time from 5:55 till 6:00, same question for this genius (I was considering him a bit more knowledgeable, but I was clearly wrong):
Anyway, on NO course more westerly than 220° Bismarck could have closed the range to PoW by almost 5000 yards in 4 minutes.
This is based on geometry and it is incontrovertible.... I guess any sane person should be able to see that on course 270° Bismarck would NOT have closed the range vs Hood and PoW. Instead, she passed from 21150 yards at 05:56:10 (salvo 6 landing) to 16450 yards at 6:00:00 (salvo 13 landing). BOTH salvo 6 and 13 were straddles, therefore this distance change is surely CORRECT.
Therefore the map published in 1990 (and drawn much before as Antonio showed above... :clap: ) is surely WRONG.
Thus, Antonio track is the only correct one, at least until Hood explosion, with Bismarck on course 220°, while the film shows a later stage of the battle. FULL STOP (I hope....)

A clear direct answer to the above (large size) argument, please, or finally SHUT-UP !


For the time being the only reasonable explanation supporting these poor deniers theory has been given by Alec:
Alecsandros wrote: "I have a feeling you are purposefully ignoring the TELEPORTATION unit mounted on Bismarck and Prinz Eugen"
:lol: :clap:


Bye, Alberto
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"There's always a danger running in the enemy at close range" (Adm.W.F.Wake-Walker)

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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by northcape » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:53 pm

Alberto Virtuani wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 8:06 am


A clear direct answer to the above (large size) argument, please, or finally SHUT-UP !

Bye, Alberto
Sorry, I still cannot read it. Can you please print it even larger, and make the font ultra-bold, and arrange it nicely with more smileys? So the other children in your kindergarten group can laugh even more.

I'm impressed by your timing specifications down to 10 seconds accuracy. For sure you don't mind sharing the original observation logs where these times are stated, together with the exact salvo description as mentioned by you? Thank you!

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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by Alberto Virtuani » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:58 pm

Hello everybody,
an ignorant (insulting) troll wrote: "I'm impressed by your timing specifications down to 10 seconds accuracy. For sure you don't mind sharing the original observation logs where these times are stated..."
I don't mind, but I would have preferred not to loose my time and this lazy guy to have been able to read back (where all this has been explained in detail already), instead of coming in only to (unsuccessfully) try to save the credibility of two losers co-deniers, cowardly running away himself from the relevant questions he has been asked (http://www.kbismarck.org/forum/viewtopi ... 798#p80790). :oops:

Here PoW GAR with an easy to read (for an average brain) timing of salvo 6 and 13....http://www.hmshood.org.uk/reference/off ... encIVa.gif
and the flight time of the British shells....http://www.hmshood.com/history/denmarks ... times2.htm

Able at least to read and make some calculation ? :think:

If this guy wants (I doubt he is able... :lol: ) to adjust 10 or 20 seconds, he is welcome, and I'm ready to accept his more precise calculations (using them in my next publication, recognizing his expertise), but this will not change the fact that Bismarck was on a course around 220° from 5:56:10 till 6:00:30 at least (or in any case she was NEVER on a more westerly course as pretended by his co-deniers) and, therefore, the map used by the Baron in 1990 is totally WRONG (with all the due consequences on Bismarck RoF at DS, as per the PG film).
This was the topic of the discussion, not my usage of smileys and fonts (if this insolent guy has not understood it yet, I'm fed up by now to have to repeat the same things to people intentionally not willing to understand).


the same poor person wrote: "Sorry, I still cannot read it. Can you please print it even larger...."
I do can enlarge a bit to his shame (I hope his eyes are a bit better than his brain):
I STILL CANNOT READ HIS POSITION about my argument above re. the closure rate (almost 5000 yards in 4 minutes) being incompatible with Bismarck on course 270° , because he has none useful for his agenda and he cannot provide any value added, as usual !

Just a pitiable RN hooligan and a denier at any cost..... :kaput:


Bye, Alberto
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"There's always a danger running in the enemy at close range" (Adm.W.F.Wake-Walker)

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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by Algonquin-R17 » Thu Oct 11, 2018 5:28 am

Antonio Bonomi wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:27 am
Hello everybody,

as usual, an " hooligan/denier " with poor competence and knowledge about what he is talking about jumped in trying to defend what cannot be defended by anybody, ... simply because it is absolutely incorrect as it simply shows, ... given what we have today available as evidence.

He wrote :
Yeah, how could a battle map drawn by two of the actual gunnery officers aboard Bismarck and PE possibly be accurate?
It is an incorrect statement obviously, because the Baron never made that map that was made only by Paul Schmalenbach.

It is enough to look for reference and confirmation to the Jochen Brennecke 1960 book Schlachtschiff Bismarck, ... where it was printed, ... before Schmalenbach used it again on 1971 for his Prinz Eugen warship profile book, ... long before the Baron went back ( ??? diplomatically ??? ) re-utilizing it on his 1990 second edition book ( :shock: ), ... after having used the most correct and available one ( the 1980 one ) made ( still with Paul Schmalenbach starting the map correction on his 1978 one ) by using both the Prinz Eugen official battle map and the PoW correct track become available too, ... looking and checking the photos and film that became available meanwhile, ... as clearly explained on the map caption itself by Paul Schmalenbach ( guess why :wink: ), ... just as it must be.


Brennecke_1960_map_03.jpg

Brennecke_book_ISBN_dates_03.jpg



No accurate map can be made about this battle disregarding the Prinz Eugen original track as well as the PoW original one.

It was enough to work on it following Paul Schmalenbach own evolution of this battle map creation, with a minimum historical research attitude.

But I have already explained all those maps evolution to everybody time ago ( 2 years ago ) on this thread, here :

http://www.kbismarck.org/forum/viewtopi ... 195#p68342

and here :

http://www.kbismarck.org/forum/viewtopi ... 240#p68500

Some of the " hooligan/deniers " know about all this since the 2003/2004 long discussion with R. Winklareth on this forum too.

Never for one single second that map had a single chance to be a value add part into a today ( 2018 ) historical discussion about this battle map.

It is a loosing discussion example since the beginning of it as I have explained long time ago, ... and it only show a really poor competence and knowledge by who is supporting it, … together with his real intention by using it in the way it is done today.

This once again demonstrate, ... just like on other discussions, ... like on the Court Martial threat and the Norfolk bearings/distance, ... another miserable and pathetic defeat received by the " hooligan/deniers ", ... while they are unsuccesfully trying to discredit in any way they can, … somebody that only wants to work on an historical re-construction.

Bye Antonio

Hello Antonio,

I know you have discussed this 1990 map many times however even if it was only plotted by Paul Schmalenbach he was still a German officer present at the time. As such, in my opinion only, he would make his best efforts to record this event accurately, because it was a significant event in the German Navy. He would have no motivation to be sloppy about it as he was contributing to German Naval history.

I do not know enough about it at this point however I will continue to study it. One statement that I will make is that I cannot accept that anyone, original battle participants or current naval students can determine from the film or photos at what compass bearing the ship was on based upon the direction the guns were pointing. Certainly any 12 opinions on that would not have a consensus about. I would need something more substantial than that to dismiss the map.

Thank you,

Bob

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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by Alberto Virtuani » Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:24 am

Hello Bob,

the "1990" map (in reality a copy of the map done by Schmalenbach in '60, as Antonio has shown above, and that was later amended by the same Schmalenbach in his 1978 much more correct one) is proven wrong by the PoW salvo plot (http://www.hmshood.org.uk/reference/off ... encIVa.gif) as Bismarck could not be on any more westerly course than 220° from 5:56:10 till 6:00:30 (straddles fall of shells), simply because she closed the range to PoW by almost 5000 yards in 4 minutes in the meantime and this is only possible with the ships on a very converging course.

The data from PoW salvo plot is irrefutable and we don't even need to discuss about Schmalenbach's maps reliability in 60's vs 70's, or about the film /photos to definitely dismiss this old map.
The film and the photos however (studied with the level of detail that Antonio has put in each frame/photo) let us to reconstruct with a good degree of approximation which was Bismarck course also after 6:03, until 6:09. However, before 6:01 there is no space for any "turn away" of both German ships.


Bye, Alberto
Last edited by Alberto Virtuani on Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:33 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by Antonio Bonomi » Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:52 am

Hello everybody,

@ Algonquin-R17,

you wrote :
I know you have discussed this 1990 map many times however even if it was only plotted by Paul Schmalenbach he was still a German officer present at the time. As such, in my opinion only, he would make his best efforts to record this event accurately, because it was a significant event in the German Navy. He would have no motivation to be sloppy about it as he was contributing to German Naval history.
I agree with you on the above statements, Paul Schmalenbach on 1960 did surely his best efforts to help Jochen Brennecke on realizing the DS battle map given what he had available at the time, and I assume his memories and few photos, based on what he wrote after on his 1978 map caption.

You added :
I do not know enough about it at this point however I will continue to study it. One statement that I will make is that I cannot accept that anyone, original battle participants or current naval students can determine from the film or photos at what compass bearing the ship was on based upon the direction the guns were pointing. Certainly any 12 opinions on that would not have a consensus about. I would need something more substantial than that to dismiss the map.
The study of what Paul Schmalenbach did to evolve his DS battle map realizations will surely help you to understand the whole evolution of this historical battle map re-construction.
I made this study myself on 2003, when I first started working on my DS battle map in order to challenge and demonstrate being wrong R. Winklareth theory about the Bismarck reverse photos.
It is a mandatory step to make, otherwise you run a risk to go in confusion with maps and books and year of their publication.

I already described the evolution showing the maps on the above links, but I can summarize it to make it easier for you to understand what Paul Schmalenbach did :

1) On 1960 he realized the above map for Jochen Brennecke book.
2) On 1971 he used that map on his Prinz Eugen Warship profile magazine publication.
3) On 1972 he already had made a different version of the battle map for the Bismarck Warship profile magazine publication.

Now I assume in the timeframe 1972 to 1978 the Prinz Eugen original battle map became available as well as the Prinz Eugen Rheinubung film.

In fact we had after realized by Paul Schmalenbach for his book on Prinz Eugen history a next evolution of the DS battle maps.

4) On 1978 he realized a new version of the battle map using the PG original track and drawing the Bismarck on top of it, still the British ship tracks were not correct, but in the photo caption Schmalenbach clearly described the process he used to determine the Bismarck correct track using the photo and film analyzed in the correct sequence of the events, now that he had the PG track and key events available associated to the correct timings. To be noted that he surely at that point had available other documents like the Jasper report, the Reimann torpedo report the PG KTB ... etcetera etcetera, ... so he could do from a German track stand point a much more complete work on their tracks.

5) On 1980 he was requested obviously by the Baron von Mullenheim Rechberg to work on his book map, together with Prof. Jurgen Rohwer from Stuttgart, and he obviously started from his 1978 German track map, but now he had also available the British correct tracks from the PoW documents having become available too, so he could really do finally his best merging all the available official information.
Even the Norfolk and Suffolk were finally placed in an almost correct position on this last realized DS battle map.
The result is the map we all know very well since it is widely used on all books and websites, like you can verify on this website as well as on the Hood website too.

This is what Paul Schmalenbach did and his maps evolution.

After having realized all this, that final 1980 DS battle map was the base of my 2003/2005 work that starting from that correct reference base, developed further more what Paul Schmalenbach correctly did already on 1980, in more details.

Last point is obviously related to the fact that the Baron von Mullenheim Rechberg used on 1990 for his second book edition the old and wrong 1960 first map realized by Paul Schmalenbach.
He did it after having utilized the last produced 1980 correct one, since the old wrong 1960 one was abandoned by Paul Schmalenbach himself long before obviously.

I do not have the answer to the reasons of this occurrence but only my personal opinion, ... and everybody can guess why he did it now.

What is for sure is the fact that the 1960 initial DS battle map is wrong by the own admission of Paul Schmalenbach who initially made it, having had after the original documents that made it obsolete and demonstrate its evident limits, just as we can all very easily verify with today original documents availability exactly like Paul Schmalenbach did on 1978/1980 long before us.

Hope it is all clear now, ...

Bye Antonio
In order to honor a soldier, we have to tell the truth about what happened over there. The whole, hard, cold truth. And until we do that, we dishonor her and every soldier who died, who gave their life for their country. ( Courage Under Fire )

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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by wadinga » Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:41 pm

Hello Antonio,
I agree with you on the above statements, Paul Schmalenbach on 1960 did surely his best efforts to help Jochen Brennecke on realizing the DS battle map given what he had available at the time, and I assume his memories and few photos, based on what he wrote after on his 1978 map caption.
Have you seen Brennecke's new map in the 6th revision of Schlachtschiff Bismarck, published in 2003? Like the Baron, he apparently decided that final 1980 map was not final and therefore obsolete.

Sadly this apparently excellent and comprehensive work has failed to inform a wider world market by being translated into English (American). in 1975, Brennecke was co-founder and longtime Secretary-General of the Deutsche Gesellschaft für Schiffahrts - naval history society so publishers should not waste their time considering committing to paper the far-fetched fantasies of Conspiracy Theorists, but instead publish an English edition of his final factual Bismarck work.

It would be fascinating if any of our German readers could get access to the current version of the book. Brennecke with his own Kriegsmarine experience and close relations with veterans and source material has already thrown light for us here in this forum on the matter of radar detection systems aboard Bismarck, we must ask why he had developed a new map showing Bismarck turning away before 06:00! Perhaps in the accompanying text the secret which has been kept for so long is made clear. Why is the track of Bismarck such a mystery, requiring reconstruction? Why was it never apparently established in 1941 when the Kriegsmarine wash-up on the disastrous mission rejected Brinkmann's "useless and worthless" Gefechtskizze which didn't even represent the flagship's course? Hans Henning von Schultz was given resources to create an ersatz KTB for Bismarck- but there was no map of Bismarck's final victory?

I am still studying that closing rate Alberto, rest assured. :think:
I think it is possible that these times may be in error up to as much as two minutes but I am satisfied that relative to each other they are correct.
All the best

wadinga
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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by Alberto Virtuani » Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:43 pm

Hello everybody,

I was thinking that after such an humiliation, this guy was wise (and clever) enough to shut-up but apparently he is not:
Wadinga wrote: "I am still studying that closing rate Alberto, rest assured."
Good study Mr.Wadinga ! :lol:
In no way Bismarck could have closed range by almost 5000 yards in 4 minutes from 5:56:10 till 6:00:30 being on a more westerly course than 220°(before 5:56 we have photo NH69722 showing Bismarck almost perfectly in line with PG, on a course around 220°). The old (as demonstrated by Antonio) "1990" map is obviously and simply WRONG.

It's mathematics and geometry, topics that Mr.Wadinga has surely to study a lot, but from what he posted (from Rowell), it looks like he concentrates on trying to invent his own different battle, just to support his crazy theory.

I rest very assured he will never come to a solution, but I'm a bit annoyed by him coming back WITHOUT any answer to the argument. :kaput:


Bye, Alberto


P.S.
he wrote: "Hans Henning von Schultz was given resources to create an ersatz KTB for Bismarck"
BTW at what time does H.H.Von Schultz put the first turn of Bismarck to avoid torpedoes ? 5:55 (Mr.Wadinga theory) or 6:03 (Antonio's reconstruction) ? :lol: :lol: :lol:
Last edited by Alberto Virtuani on Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bismarck firing procedures at DS

Post by Bill Jurens » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:25 pm

It is important, I think, to keep in mind that the track charts as published in the secondary literature, etc., are primarily intended to be schematic in nature, i.e. illustrative, rather than in any sense technically definitive. One of the problems of producing a track chart, when one is demanded, is that in spite of discrepancies in records -- which are common, and often significant -- the poor cartographer/draftsperson has to put the line showing the ship course SOMEWHERE, and it's very depiction as a thin line suggests a degree of certainty which is often somewhat out of proportion to its actual validity. This is (probably) the situation Pinchin faced when doing drawings for the Hood loss inquiry; he had to come up with SOMETHING, so he simply gritted his teeth -- as I have often done in preparing illustrations and maps myself -- and placed whatever information wherever seemed best. Drawing a track chart with a pen is what's usually demanded, but more often an airbrush would, in reality, be more appropriate. Antonio has put a lot of work into this, and his efforts should not be discounted. Credit -- and a good deal of credit -- where credit is due. But readers should realize that, like any other human, his selections of what's 'right' and what's wrong in a cartographic depiction will inevitably incorporate some explicit and implicit biases. In other words, like anyone else, he has an explicit or implicit 'agenda'.

In that regard, it's important, I think, to interpret most of the published track charts as illustrative, indicating that the courses of Bismarck and Prinz Eugen were, during the midpoint of the action, somewhat erratic, and that the course(s) of Prince of Wales after disengagement at c. 0604 or so, are also fairly highly stylized and/or idealized. I'm not sure that one can, historically, go much farther than that without the introduction of significant new evidence.

It's a bit like painting a description of Columbus' first landing in America. How might one best select the expression on the great explorer's face as he first encounters the inhabitants of island(s)? Some, feeling Columbus to be the harbinger of doom to those unfortunates, might depict an insensitive scowl. Others, feeling Columbus might be overjoyed at finally arriving on land somewhere, and not meeting an immediately hostile reception, might depict him with a radiant smile. Of course nobody knows -- and perhaps nobody ever really new -- what Columbus' actual expression was, and depictions thereof often reveal more about the artist than about the subject.

The line between realistic and imaginative depiction, in this and other places, is often difficult or impossible to define with precision. As are the precise track charts of the four opponents in Denmark Strait on 24 May.

Bill Jurens

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