Hitting the Gun Barrel

Warship design and construction, terminology, navigation, hydrodynamics, stability, armor schemes, damage control, etc.
mcollins00
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Hitting the Gun Barrel

Post by mcollins00 » Thu Jun 28, 2018 4:54 am

I understand how a warship's turrets are armored against Gunfire, but what about the actual barrels of the guns themselves? Are they armored too? What would it take to knock out the barrel of a large caliber naval gun? was this something that ever happened?

As an example, at Denmark Strait, Prince Eugene's guns couldn't penetrate Prince of Wales' turrets, but what would happen if one of those 8" shells hit one of the barrels?

Thorsten Wahl
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Re: Hitting the Gun Barrel

Post by Thorsten Wahl » Thu Jun 28, 2018 1:33 pm

they produce a indentation.
If memory serves this happened to Seydlitz during the Jutland battle 1916.
Meine Herren, es kann ein siebenjähriger, es kann ein dreißigjähriger Krieg werden – und wehe dem, der zuerst die Lunte in das Pulverfaß schleudert!

OpanaPointer
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Re: Hitting the Gun Barrel

Post by OpanaPointer » Thu Jun 28, 2018 1:55 pm


Mostlyharmless
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Re: Hitting the Gun Barrel

Post by Mostlyharmless » Thu Jun 28, 2018 10:44 pm

It happened to South Dakota, possibly more than once. At Santa Cruz https://www.navsource.org/archives/01/57a.htm has:

“The ship received a direct hit from a 500-pound bomb on top of Main Battery Turret # 1. It did not penetrate but deformed two of the three 16-Inch barrels of #2 turret.”

At the Second Naval Battle of Guadalcanal, she was hit by a 14” shell and the damage report https://www.history.navy.mil/research/l ... -no57.html has:

“Fragments and blast deflected upward from the point of impact demolished the gas seal and water shed for 30 feet around the circumference of the barbette, gouged the gun sleeves of the right and center guns of Turret III and ignited the gun bloomers. Some difficulty was experienced in training the turret after the hit but it was believed that the turret was still able to fire.”

Robert Lundgren and Nathan Okun have criticised that report, commenting “For these reasons, the preparation of the damage report had been given a very low priority and the late date of its publication and the paltry seven sources listed as being used in writing it are a reflection of just how low a priority it had.” However, the criticism tended to centre on what types of shell had hit rather than the damage itself.

OpanaPointer
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Re: Hitting the Gun Barrel

Post by OpanaPointer » Thu Jun 28, 2018 11:10 pm

The report's online for those who want to see it. https://www.history.navy.mil/research/l ... -no57.html

Francis Marliere
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Re: Hitting the Gun Barrel

Post by Francis Marliere » Fri Jun 29, 2018 8:09 am

I guess you probably know, but in doubt, I precise: as far as I know, Richelieu's missing barrel was not destroyed by an ennemy shell, but by the explosion of a projectile inside the barrel.

Regards,

Francis Marliere

OpanaPointer
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Re: Hitting the Gun Barrel

Post by OpanaPointer » Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:15 pm

Actually, I didn't know. Thanks for the more accurate info. :clap:

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Alberto Virtuani
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Re: Hitting the Gun Barrel

Post by Alberto Virtuani » Tue Jul 03, 2018 7:35 am

Hello OpenaPointer,
Francis Marliere is right, the gun N.7 of turret II of Richelieu was damaged by the premature explosion of the shell inside the barrel during the engagement against Barham and Resolution when at anchor at Dakar.
Similar (but less spectacular) problems happened to gun N.8 and later to N.5, always in turret II with standard charge SD21.

The cause of the problem was analyzed by an official inquiry and conclusions are posted below (from Jordan-Dumas book "French Battleships" pag.149). The propellant change (initially suspected to be responsible due to two different charges (SD19 and SD21 being used, SD19 re-manufactured in emergency) was not the cause, instead it was the shell design, with cavities (that were initially intended to host toxic gas) and that generated a weak point in the shell, that could be detonated by the pressure of the gases of the charge, already increased by the high temperature inside the turret.

Turret I was safe only because the re-manufactured charges (SD19 was initially intended for Strasbourg 330 mm guns) were under-powered. The problem was solved filling the cavities with cement and applying more resistant caps to them.

Barrel_Problem_Richelieu.jpg
Barrel_Problem_Richelieu.jpg (56.74 KiB) Viewed 347 times

Bye, Alberto
"It takes three years to build a ship; it takes three centuries to build a tradition" (Adm.A.B.Cunningham)

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Herr Nilsson
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Re: Hitting the Gun Barrel

Post by Herr Nilsson » Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:31 am

Thorsten Wahl wrote:
Thu Jun 28, 2018 1:33 pm
they produce a indentation.
If memory serves this happened to Seydlitz during the Jutland battle 1916.
Image
Regards

Marc

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RF
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Re: Hitting the Gun Barrel

Post by RF » Fri Jul 06, 2018 7:49 am

mcollins00 wrote:
Thu Jun 28, 2018 4:54 am
I understand how a warship's turrets are armored against Gunfire, but what about the actual barrels of the guns themselves? Are they armored too? What would it take to knock out the barrel of a large caliber naval gun? was this something that ever happened?

As an example, at Denmark Strait, Prince Eugene's guns couldn't penetrate Prince of Wales' turrets, but what would happen if one of those 8" shells hit one of the barrels?
On 27 May 1941 one of the guns on Dora turret on Bismarck did receive a direct hit with the barrel apparently splitting and peeling back ''like a banana''
''Give me a Ping and one Ping only'' - Sean Connery.

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