SMS MarkGraf V USS Texas.

Historical what if discussions, hypothetical operations, battleship vs. battleship engagements, design your own warship, etc.
Tiornu
Supporter
Posts: 1222
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 6:13 am
Location: Ex Utero

Post by Tiornu »

All our discussions about immune zones and such are merely discussions about probability. A 1-ton chunk of steel traveling at 1800 feet per second really doesn't care about what it's "supposed" to do. Maybe it will strike a plate with an undetected flaw. Maybe the ship's roll will present a more favorable angle at just the right moment. Maybe the shell will bounce of a crane foundation and hit the armor from a direction the designers never anticipated.
Both Yamato and Musashi were struck by numerous bombs. Most were not significant in threatening the ship, but a few were. The Yamatos are known to have inherited light armor for the secondary battery from the cruisers that donated the guns, and this characteristic is often criticized. It is thought that the bomb in question managed to deflect into the hoists before exploding, and the protection from that angle was inadequate.
Have a look at this photo. The delicate-looking puff indicates where all that powder is burning. For scale, just imagine the size of an individual person, which would probably be too small to see.
http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/imag ... h62580.jpg
User avatar
tommy303
Senior Member
Posts: 1528
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 4:19 pm
Location: Arizona
Contact:

Post by tommy303 »

Hi Bgile,

If dropped from the recommended height, a dive bomber's ordnance can certainly do the job, depending on bomb design and weight vs deck armour thickness, arrangement, and quality. The problem is, that many dive bomber jocks would press on too low and release too late in an effort to get hits. In such cases the bomb may not actually attain the velocity it needs vs heavy armour. This was the case with various DB attacks against Tirpitz. The dive bombing would be more accurate than the level bombing, usually, as the dive bomber may be manouvered easily enough in its dive to keep the sight where the pilot wants it. It is much more difficult to do that from a level bomber against a moving target, and level bombing from high up was usually ineffective against fast moving warships at sea until innovative weapons like the terminally guided Fritz X came into being.

As Tiornu says, though much of this is hypothetical.

Their shoulders held the sky suspended;
They stood and Earth's foundations stay;
What God abandoned these defended;
And saved the sum of things for pay.
User avatar
tommy303
Senior Member
Posts: 1528
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 4:19 pm
Location: Arizona
Contact:

Post by tommy303 »

Yes the midships hit on Bismarck was a surface runner or at least one that was set too shallow. If it was not a matter of setting, then the probability is that the pilot dropped his fish too close in. Torpedos when dropped from an airplane will tend to plunge deep and then move upwards towards the surface until hyrdostatic pressure on the depth keeping membrane indicates it is running to shallow. This causes it to go deeper again, but not as much as its first entry. It will tend to go up and down until it finds its proper depth and steadies on. Most torpedos of the day required about 500m run before arming and finding depth was accomplished.

As you know, some torpedos are better than others. Like any other weapon, one will have failures.

All in all, what a bomb, shell, or torpedo does when it reaches the target is somewhat serrandipitous. What one should do and what one will do are two often different things.

Their shoulders held the sky suspended;
They stood and Earth's foundations stay;
What God abandoned these defended;
And saved the sum of things for pay.
User avatar
marcelo_malara
Senior Member
Posts: 1850
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:14 pm
Location: buenos aires

Post by marcelo_malara »

I was under the impression that bombs dropped by dive bombers were always too low to reach terminal velocity. Is that correct, or am I in error?
You have to add the velocity of the launching plane, what would be somewhat about 150 m/s.
Post Reply