King George V vs. Rodney

Historical what if discussions, hypothetical operations, battleship vs. battleship engagements, design your own warship, etc.
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RF
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Re: King George V vs. Rodney

Post by RF » Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:24 am

Yes, Rodney can steer to try to maintain the desired angle, but battles are fluid and I think it is unlikely that the desired angle will be exactly maintained for the whole action as the KGV moves and Rodney has to counter move to correct. There are many caveats to this, not least as you say Rodney's ability to steer and also for the ability for steerage orders to be given and transmitted......
''Give me a Ping and one Ping only'' - Sean Connery.

Steve-M
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Re: King George V vs. Rodney

Post by Steve-M » Thu Jul 26, 2018 2:59 pm

RF wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:24 am
Yes, Rodney can steer to try to maintain the desired angle, but battles are fluid and I think it is unlikely that the desired angle will be exactly maintained for the whole action as the KGV moves and Rodney has to counter move to correct.
Most real world battles have a variety of tactical factors that make maintaining a specific target angle unlikely, eg. maintaining formation with the battle line, evading torpedo attack, etc. In a simple one on one daylight brawl in open the ocean for this thread...less so. And as I said, Rodney doesn't need to strictly maintain 45 degrees at all times. Given the strength of her belt even at a perfect right angle relative to KGV's guns, she's got some leeway until the range drops pretty low for a daylight duel.

Of course, I'd also say the tactical situation you've drawn up seems unfavorable to KGV: where Rodney needs to do little more than turn to counter KGV's movements, you have KGV making a high speed dash to catch a better angle of attack. What does that do for her gunnery? How readily will she maintain a target angle of her own? The latter is particularly important, given that as noted earlier on this thread by Dave, Rodney's guns will penetrate KGV's belt at usefully longer ranges than the converse.
RF wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:24 am
There are many caveats to this, not least as you say Rodney's ability to steer and also for the ability for steerage orders to be given and transmitted......
There are always caveats (lucky hits, machinery breakdowns, problems with quad turrets, etc.) in the real world. On paper, those caveats tend to wash, as such issues can and do affect both sides in the real world. Hood blew up after 5 whole salvos from Bismarck. What were the odds of that? What were the odds of utterly obsolete biplanes attacking in horrific weather managing to hobble one of the mightiest battleships ever built? The real world laughs at paper comparisons, but...paper comparisons are still entertaining :D

paul.mercer
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Re: King George V vs. Rodney

Post by paul.mercer » Thu Jul 26, 2018 9:58 pm

Gentlemen,
Have we not had a similar debate re Rodney v Bismarck and the general impression was almost the same as this, especially re Bismarck/KGV being faster and with the end result of both ships beating hell out of each other and retiring without a clear winner?
PS, Rightly or wrongly I'd still put my money on Rodney, particularly if she was in good nick with an experienced crew,not like how she was in the Bismarck battle!

Steve-M
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Re: King George V vs. Rodney

Post by Steve-M » Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:26 am

paul.mercer wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 9:58 pm
Have we not had a similar debate re Rodney v Bismarck and the general impression was almost the same as this, especially re Bismarck/KGV being faster and with the end result of both ships beating hell out of each other and retiring without a clear winner?
There was, but one should keep in mind Bismarck and KGV aren't perfect substitutes for each other. Bismarck's guns are no less capable than what Rodney is bringing to the table, and the space arrayed armor gives her excellent protection.
paul.mercer wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 9:58 pm
PS, Rightly or wrongly I'd still put my money on Rodney, particularly if she was in good nick with an experienced crew,not like how she was in the Bismarck battle!
IMHO, assuming both ships are handled well, and barring something like a shell diving under Rodney's belt and penetrating to a magazine, I'd give it to whoever knocked out a main turret first. On paper at least, that should be Rodney given that her turret armor is thicker, and her guns more potent. OTOH, KGV controls the range, and the odds of Rodney knocking out a turret early at relatively long range are pretty low.

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