Bismarck Wreck Salvage

Anything concerning the wreck. Expeditions, submersibles, photos, etc.
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Javier L.
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Bismarck Wreck Salvage

Postby Javier L. » Sat Nov 13, 2004 2:51 am

Hello, I was wondering if it is technically possible to salvage the entire wreck of the Bismarck with today's technology considering the enormous depth it lies. Are there any antecedents of big ships being salvaged from such depth? What methods are usually employed to raise sunken ships and which one could be successful with Bismarck?

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Postby José M. Rico » Sun Nov 14, 2004 7:14 pm

I think it can be technically possible although it would be the most difficult sea salvage ever and very expensive. But first you should ask yourself why do you want to move the wreck at all since it is considered a war grave. Rescue methods? I don't know, perhaps something like this:

Image

Image

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Javier L.
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Postby Javier L. » Sun Nov 14, 2004 11:39 pm

It is a war grave but I think we must be realistic, the ship sank more than 60 years ago and there are no human remains down there anymore. Besides in another 60 years the wreck will be more deteriorated if not gone due to sea corrosion, but if it is raised now it could be preserved as a floating museum for future generations. It would be very nice to contemplate the Bismarck again. Take the hull and all other missing parts to the surface and complete the puzzle!
Good idea using floating pontoons. There should be a big mother ship to put them in position. The weather would be a major factor to consider as well.

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Postby Ed S. » Tue Jan 11, 2005 12:48 am

As having a relative who died on the Bismarck, I can say that the idea of raising it is completely morbid, and the ultimate desecration of their grave. You have to remember that this is their final resting place. Just like you would never think of raising the USS Arizona, there are just some things you don't do. I could propose the question to you, if you were someone famous, sixty years after your death, would want someone to come dig up your grave and help themselves to some of the belongings you were buried with? Also, even if there are no human remains, just the fact that men died there should be reason enough not to disturb it, and now you want to turn it into a tourist attraction? And what puzzle would you be putting back together? We know almost everything there is to know about the Rhine Exercise, we know it wasn't sunk by the British, so once I again I ask you what puzzle would you be solving? Thank God it is a war grave and can't be disturbed in anyway, so, no disrespect, people with your kind of mentality, can't desecrate this site the way the Titanic has been desecrated. I don't think that recovering people's belongings will help us to understand how the ship sunk, or give any relavence to the Bismarck story. I don't think anyone can understand this unless you have lost a relative in an event such as this one. If anything you should preserve the wreck and create an underwater museum, so future generations could learn from this time in history. Bismarck on the bottom of the ocean reminds us all of a time when the world went mad. That is why it should not be raised or robbed.

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Postby Javier L. » Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:09 pm

Please don't misunderstand my words, it was not my intention to hurt anyone's feelings and if I did I apologize. The sailors who died aboard the Bismarck deserve the maximum respect just like those of the Hood or any other ship sunk in similar circumstances.

The way Titanic has been desecrated by private parties is a shame, that is why I thought that before any third party tries to do that, if it wouldn't be better for serious organizations (veteran survivor organizations, Blohm & Voss, etc) with support of the German Government to join together and salvage the entire ship.

That way it would easier to mourn the fallen if there is someplace where people could gather around the real ship instead of having to get in one of those small submersibles down to the ocean floor. The wreck can't be preserved down there but in the surface it could be maintained in acceptable conditions.

That is all I wanted to say.

Javier

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Postby Ed S. » Wed Jan 12, 2005 2:28 am

If I had offended you in anyway, then I do apologize, but this is a subject that I am obviously very passionate about. Me personally, see no reason to salvage the ship, I have been on memorial services conducted over the spot where the ship sank, and I think that by honoring the men this way, to remember that this is the spot where these men fell, and it should be honored this way. For almost 63 years, their home has been the bottum of the ocean, may they rest in peace down there. I think it would be different if no one died on it, like in the case with the Graf Spee, which I know for some time they have been trying to raise. In my opinion best of luck to them.

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Raise the Bismarck?

Postby Hosse » Sun Feb 27, 2005 12:56 am

I am a US Navy veteran, and a related to a crew member of the Bismarck (Werner Hosse). The great ship should be treated as a war memorial, regardless of whether there are still any of crew on board. If you're going to bring up something, make it on of her great guns. Afterall, that's one of the things she was famous for. It would also be easier and cheaper.
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Postby Bgile » Sat Mar 12, 2005 1:39 am

I visit the Gettysburg battlefield periodically. Thousands of American soldiers died there, but I am sure glad it has been preserved and I can go see where they fought and died. If I have an ancestor who was killed there (and I might), it doesn't make any difference to me.

Personally, I feel that the dead are honored more by people being able to visit the place where they gave their lives than for it to be some spot on the ocean floor where all evidence of their plight will eventually be gone. I doubt there are many people who are aware of the incredible suffering the crew went though. Recovering and displaying the wreck would make that possible for many generations to come.

Restoring the Arizona is not the same thing. It was an unremarkable ship and much of it was completely destroyed. It is visible to anyone who wants to go see it. The Bismarck is out in the ocean where he can be forgotten.

I can certainly understand why others might not feel the way I do.

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The Wreck of the Bismarck

Postby Hosse » Sat Mar 12, 2005 2:12 am

Alas, there are many war memorials from countless battles (perhaps to many, but that'a another topic). The Bismarck, as with the Arizona, and many other ships, are now tombs. As such, they should be undisturbed. Bring up one, or all of her great guns--Anton, Bertha, Ceasar, and Dora, but leave the ship for her crew.
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Wreck of the Bismarck

Postby Hosse » Sat Mar 12, 2005 8:00 pm

I noticed an error on my last post. The Bismarck's great guns were, as everyone knows, Anton, Bruno, Caesar, and Dora. I guess I shouldn't be doing two things at once. My point remains the same however--the crew paid for the great ship with their lives. Both the Bismarck and her crew deserve to remain at peace. Bring up her guns. Set up a war memorial and naval war museum, but please leave them alone.
Hosse

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Let her be

Postby cvonhout » Sun Mar 13, 2005 12:58 pm

Let Bismarck and her crew be, that is the only thing i could say about this topic.
It's a memorial, and a sailors burrial place.

Chris.
Admiraal M.A. de Ruyter.

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Hosse
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The Wreck of the Bismarck

Postby Hosse » Sun Mar 13, 2005 5:05 pm

Amen Chris Amen.

:clap:
Hosse

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Rob Perkins
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Postby Rob Perkins » Wed Mar 16, 2005 5:56 pm

Whether or not the Bismarck should be raised is obviously a very sensative subject but the fact remains that if the wreck is left where it is then eventually it will disintegrate. From what I've read this process could take hundreds of years.

If the wreck was raised and then preserved as a floating museum is it likely that it would be preseved for hundreds of years or as time passes and the next few generations show less and less interest would it eventually be sold for scrap or even, God forbid, taken out to sea and sunk again!?

One thing I have to say is that many people in these forums refer to the Bismarck as "she" but it has always been my understanding that Admiral Lutjens considered the Bismarck to be male. Just thought I'd mention it.

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The Wreck of the Bismarck

Postby Hosse » Sat Mar 19, 2005 3:31 pm

All memorials fall away...in time. Even the Pyramids are finally crumbing. If something is to be salvaged, it should be the Bismarck's four great guns. But, leave the ship itself to the men who fought and died on it. It is their tomb more than our historial relic.

And Rob, your correct. The Bismarck is generally referred to as male(after all, it was named about Graf Otto von Bismarck). However, being an "old" US Navy guy, I'm used to referring to ships as "she". Sorry.
Hosse

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Postby Peter Graham » Sun Mar 20, 2005 11:56 pm

For Gods sake leave the wreck alone ! As a diver I have visited many wrecks which loss of life occured. These are places of quiet reverence, claimed by the sea and a fitting resting place for lost sailors.
Can you imagine the senario if The Bismark was raised. Hoards of tourists with cameras swarming over places where men fought and died.
Any deep sea salvage company will tell you that it is impossible to raise a wreck from these depths, thank god and as for raising the guns, the huge turrets contained a large crew, which nearly all perished so these are war graves in themselves so please let The Bismark rest in peace.


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