Page 1 of 3

The German Dreadnought Kaiserin

Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 11:03 am
by RF
Is the Kaiserin the only dreadnought ever given a name of the female gender?
I am aware of the RN having ships called Queen Elizabeth and Queen Mary, but these names were used as a masculine diminutive, whereas Kaiserin has no actual military semblance that I am aware of.
If indeed there is no military semblance then presumably it is or was a departure of the Germans from naming their ships after military commanders and more distant military hereos such as Frederick the Great, what would the reason be for that?

Re: The German Dreadnought Kaiserin

Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 11:50 am
by Tiornu
I don't understand what you're asking.
The British had a few female names, and the Russians also used a couple.

Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 5:35 pm
by Gary
Hi RF.

I'm a bit puzzled too.
Kaiserin was the wife of the Kaiser and so there was nothing wrong in naming a vessel after her.
Queen Mary was the wife of George V and thus the battlecruiser that died at Jutland bore her name.

Off the top of my head, HMS Erin was another (British) female name.

Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 8:01 pm
by iankw
Hi Gary

Off the top of my head isn't Erin a reference to Ireland, from the dim and distant past? Not that that explains it use in any way.

I think RF means the Germans don't seem to have used female names for ships. I am sure he will clarify what he means momentarily.

Ian

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2007 9:53 am
by RF
iankw wrote:
I think RF means the Germans don't seem to have used female names for ships. I am sure he will clarify what he means momentarily.

Ian
This is indeed my point - the empress was only the consort of the Kaiser and not the reigning monarch in her own right.

War being seen as a male preserve - particulary in Germany - it seems unusual in using feminine titles for an instrument of battle, not very macho.

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2007 9:55 am
by RF
iankw wrote:
Off the top of my head isn't Erin a reference to Ireland, from the dim and distant past? Not that that explains it use in any way.

Ian
Or the Isle of Man?

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2007 1:48 pm
by iankw
There is indeed a Port Erin on the Isle of Man, although I haven't delved into it very deep. I also noted a Wiki reference to Erin as "a romatic name for Ireland used by 19th century poets....", I couldn't follow that up because everytime I open Wiki it crashes my puter!!!

So it's either or for that one.

Ian

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2007 9:19 pm
by Tiornu
Erin is Ireland.

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 1:14 am
by MichaelC
The battlecruiser Princess Royal was completed the year before Kaiserin.

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 11:39 am
by Tiornu
Kaiserin Augusta was completed a couple decades before Kaiserin.
Victoria Louise
Charlotte
Irene
Carola
Marie
Olga
Elisabeth
These were all sizeable vessels.

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 2:36 pm
by Ulrich Rudofsky
to add some more names of "female" ships/boats in the Kaiser's Navy:
Amazone
Ariadne
Alice Roosevelt
Freya
Herta
Kaiserin Auguste
Koenigin Luise
Niobe
Nymphe
Undine
Alexandrine
Victoria Luise

oh I forgot Medusa, Elisabeth, and Loreley

I can't think of any WWII Kriegsmarine ships with female names (Nymphe II was a floating AA battery ex Tordenskjoeld)

Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 1:53 pm
by iankw
Why would the Kaiser's navy have a "Alice Roosevelt"? I'll bet it's an obvious answer!!

Ian

Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 2:12 pm
by Ulrich Rudofsky
I don't know the whole story, but the Kaiser and Teddy Roosevelt were fond of each other. Teddy's daughter Alice ("Princess Alice or the wild animal in good clothes) christened the Kaiser Willi's yacht METEOR (there were 5 SMY Meteors). http://www.scripophily.net/toshconewyo1.html

Posted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 9:55 pm
by iankw
Thanks Ulrich.

Sorry not to get back to you earlier, after a week trying to come to terms with XP I finally went back to 98SE - so I've been offline for a while.

Cheers, Ian.

Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 10:51 am
by RF
Ulrich Rudofsky wrote:
can't think of any WWII Kriegsmarine ships with female names (Nymphe II was a floating AA battery ex Tordenskjoeld)
But some WW2 German ships did have American and Latin American place names, such as Tacoma, Portland, Niagara, Rio de Janeiro and of course Bismarck!