The surrender of the High Seas Fleet remembered

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paulcadogan
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The surrender of the High Seas Fleet remembered

Post by paulcadogan » Sat Nov 22, 2014 1:19 pm

What an event that was - on such a scale...!

Some good photos, plus a great plan view of the fleet formation... it must have been a stunning sight!

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-30128199
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Re: The surrender of the High Seas Fleet remembered

Post by aurora » Sat Nov 22, 2014 4:51 pm

Excellent reporting Paul and great pictures too-for which many thanks-the whole sad business was triggered by the sheer tardiness of the peace talks.The British had already circulated orders aimed at minimising the effects of scuttling, but knew in their heart of hearts that they could do little about it. If peace talks did not succeed before the Armistice ended a state of war would once again break out. If this happened, Rear Admiral von Reuter had decided that he would sink his entire Fleet rather than let the British have the ships.

Unfortunately for von Reuter, the only information that he could get about the peace talks was from the British, or what he could read in four-day-old copies of The Times. This lack of up to date information had a bizarre consequence. Von Reuter must have realised that his fleet would never return to Germany, and therefore he would almost certainly have scuttled it, if only to preserve the honour of the German Navy. However his actual decision to scuttle was based on a misleading report in a copy of The Times, which was four days old when he read it. :!: :!: :!:

At Versailles the peace talks were in chaos, and as the end of the Armistice drew near, a final agreement still had not been reached. Eventually the British, tired of the whole mess, gave the German Government an ultimatum either to accept the peace terms by noon on 21 June or face renewed hostilities. That is what von Reuter read in his copy of The Times four days later and that is the information that he acted on. What he did not know is that later on the same day the Germans capitulated, accepted the terms, and the Armistice was extended until 23 June to tie up the loose ends.
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paulcadogan
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Re: The surrender of the High Seas Fleet remembered

Post by paulcadogan » Sat Nov 22, 2014 6:11 pm

Interesting! So you're saying that were it not for the stale-dated news report the scuttling might not have occurred?

What do you suppose might have happened if the HSF hadn't been scuttled?
Qui invidet minor est - He who envies is the lesser man

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aurora
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Re: The surrender of the High Seas Fleet remembered

Post by aurora » Sat Nov 22, 2014 6:36 pm

A What If Question Eh!!-GB did not want them; but some of the Allied nations may have had some use for some units- but again that is very much a MAY!! The Great War's end brought near bankruptcy to most of the European Allies -so unless other nations- say in South America did not want to by a warship at bargain basement price-They would have been scrapped just as the Grand Fleet was scrapped. :!: :!: :!:
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Jim

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paulcadogan
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Re: The surrender of the High Seas Fleet remembered

Post by paulcadogan » Sun Nov 23, 2014 3:06 am

Of course...with some being used as battle practice targets as was the case with those whose scuttling was prevented.

Still it's an intriguing thought - a modernized Derfflinger and Hindenburg in WW2!
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aurora
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Re: The surrender of the High Seas Fleet remembered

Post by aurora » Sun Nov 23, 2014 9:23 am

Ah!! the Derfflinger-she should have been totally examined ,piece by piece to establish
how best to build battlecruisers; and to improve those British battlecruisers that lived on after the holocaust of scrapping; but that I have no doubt- was too much to expect
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Re: The surrender of the High Seas Fleet remembered

Post by RF » Sun Nov 23, 2014 6:50 pm

paulcadogan wrote: Some good photos, plus a great plan view of the fleet formation... it must have been a stunning sight!
Yes Paul, for once the BBC has made an interesting article without stuffing it with political correctness.
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Re: The surrender of the High Seas Fleet remembered

Post by RF » Sun Nov 23, 2014 6:51 pm

paulcadogan wrote:
Still it's an intriguing thought - a modernized Derfflinger and Hindenburg in WW2!
Bismarck?
''Give me a Ping and one Ping only'' - Sean Connery.

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Re: The surrender of the High Seas Fleet remembered

Post by RF » Sun Nov 23, 2014 6:54 pm

paulcadogan wrote:
What do you suppose might have happened if the HSF hadn't been scuttled?
Presumably the fleet would have been parcelled out to the victorious Allies......
''Give me a Ping and one Ping only'' - Sean Connery.

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