Kirov Class Battlecruiser?

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Karl Heidenreich
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Kirov Class Battlecruiser?

Postby Karl Heidenreich » Mon Mar 13, 2006 4:45 pm

I´ve been reading about this superb and marvellous vessels, the Kirov Class. Undoubtly with her specifications it is, nominal, the most powerfull surface ship in the world (excluding the American aircraft carriers), and the biggest too:
Displacement: 28,000 tons nominal
Lenght: 252 meters (one meter more than BismarcK)
Engine power: 140,000 hp
Speed: 32 knots
Armament: you name it
But these raises some questions:
1. These Kirov Class vessels are real Battlecruisers in the tradition of the WWI BCs or they owe their name to a political stratagem? Aren´t they a superenlarged version of a guided missile frigate or destroyer?
2. Do the Americans had something similar or the only thing they had were the Iowa Class BB with the Reagan Era modifications? If so I think the Americans commited a blunder putting the Iowas out of comission.
3. Are these things battleworthy? It´s a tendency to believe that so large a military vessel is an awfull easy target (In that case the Aircraft Carriers are the biggest sitting ducks in History). An Aegis Destroyer can stand against them or not?
4. How many of these behemoths are operational?
5. Don´t you think they are very beautifull slender ships as was the Bismarck in the 40s?
Best regards to all.

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Postby Coyote850 » Tue Mar 14, 2006 4:18 am

Can't answer all your questions. But it is my understanding that the Kirovs have been retired. They where great looking ships that packed a huge punch. But in the end they cost too much too keep active. It is my understanding that one of them(maybe Kirov)had a reactor accident and was put out of commision because it was too costly and dangerous to repair her.

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Postby Karl Heidenreich » Wed Mar 15, 2006 5:19 pm

OK. I did a slight research on the Kirovs and this is what I found:
It is the most powerfull surface combat ship! And it´s a shame that most of the Kirov Class units are out of comission.
GENERAL CHARACTERISTICS
Lenght: 252 meters
Waterline lenght: 230 meters
Beam: 28.5 meters
Draft: 29.5 meters
POWERPLANT
2 x KN-3 water pressurized nuclear reactors
2 x oil fired high pressure boilkers
2x GT3A-688 steam turbines with 70,000 hp each @ 140,000 hp full power
2 shafts for 2 propellers
PERFOMANCE
Max speed: 32 knots (declared)
Endurance: 1,000 nautical miles @ full speed
RADAR & SONAR
MR-800 3D search radar @ foremast
MR-710 3D search radar @ main mast
2 x Palm Frond navigation radar
2 x Top Dome for SA-N-6 Fire Control
4 x Bass Tilt for AK 360 Fire Control
2 x Eye Bowl for SA-N-4 Fire Control
Horse Tail VDS Deep Sonar
AIRCRAFT
3 x Kamov Ka-27 choppers stored @ "below deck hangars"!!!
ARMAMENT
20 x SS-N-19 Shipwreck missiles on deck
12 x S-300F launcher with 95 missiles
2 x OSA-MA with 40 missiles
1 Kashstan Air Defense missile/gun system (is this a CIWS Phalanx equivalent?)
AK-130 mm gun
AK-630 30 mm gun
10 x torpodoes/missile tube
Udav-1 with 40 anti submarine rockets (Deph Charges?)
2 x RBU-1000 with six tube launchers

The Soviet idea was to build twelve of this magnificent vessels and begin building them in 1973. Because of that, in the eighties, the Reagan Administration re-comissioned and modified her Iowa Class Battleships.
But the Soviets never finished the plan: only four were comissioned and a fifth was broken before completion (sounds like the H Plan, isn´t it?)
The first one was the Kirov, later renamed Admiral Ushakov. This particular ship had a reactor problem, they tried to repair it and after a lot of effort decomissioned it in 2001.
The Admiral Lazarev was decomissioned in 1997 due to insufficient funding.
The Admiral Nakhimov (ex Kalinin) will be re-comissioned on a date around 2007 after an overhaul that begun in 2004.
The Petr Velily (Peter the Great) is under repairs and will be the flagship of the Russian Pacific Fleet. This one ship was the center of a scandal when a Russian Admiral told the press that she was ready to blow up due to problems in her reactor... three hours later the same Admiral re-told the reporters that they missunderstood him, that the ship was the epitome of nuclear safety. :lol:
Well, of four Kirov Class vessels at least two will be operational by 2007, and one in the Pacific. So, at least one will be ready to see the fireworks that eventually would erupt between China, Taiwan, Japan, India, Thailand, Philipines and the USN in the future.

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Postby Karl Heidenreich » Thu Oct 19, 2006 5:28 pm

Since this is my favorite modern warship I bring it to your attention:

Kirov class battlecruiser

Career

Ordered:
Laid down: June 1973
Launched: 26 December 1977
Commissioned: 30 December 1980
Decommissioned: N/A
Fate: Active in service as of 2005

The Project 1144 Orlan (meaning Sea eagle) class nuclear powered missile cruisers, are some of the largest and most powerful surface warships of the Russian Navy, though they were originally built for the Soviet Navy. In the western countries they are usually known by their NATO designation Kirov, after the lead ship of the class, the battlecruiser Kirov. They are among the biggest warships in the world, second only to aircraft carriers, and are similar in size to a World War I battleship.

Although some call the Kirov a battlecruiser or battleship because of this, the Kirov lacks the characteristic heavy armour. Soviet and Russian naval analysts always referred to it as a "large missile cruiser." It is more appropriate to consider the Kirov a super-sized guided missile cruiser, analogous to the Alaska-class cruiser which had the displacement and armament of a battlecruiser but otherwise was more similar to a heavy cruiser in mission and construction. The appearance of the Kirov class was a significant factor in the U.S. Navy recommissioning the Iowa class.


Armament
This ship has an impressive armament of missiles and guns as well as electronics. Its largest radar antenna is mounted on its foremast, and called "Top Pair" by NATO. The Kirov class's main weapons are 20 × SS-N-19 Shipwreck missiles mounted on deck, designed to engage large surface targets, and air defense is provided for with 12 × S-300F launchers with 96 missiles, 2 × Osa-MA with 40 missiles, 4 × 9K331 Tor and the Kashstan air-defence missile/gun system.

Other weapons are the automatic 130 mm AK-130 gun system, 30 mm AK-630, 10 × torpedo/missile tubes, Udav-1 with 40 anti-submarine rockets and the 2 × RBU-1000 six-tube launchers.

Deployment
The lead ship, Kirov (renamed Admiral Ushakov in 1992 for political reasons) was laid down in June of 1973 at Leningrad's Baltiysky Naval Shipyard, launched on December 26, 1977 and commissioned on December 30, 1980. When she appeared for the first time in 1981, NATO observers called her BALCOM I (Baltic Combatant I).

Kirov suffered a reactor accident in 1990 while serving in the Mediterranean Sea. Repairs were never carried out, due to lack of funds and the changing political situation in the Soviet Union. She may have been cannibalized as a spare parts cache for the other ships in her class.

In 1984 the second ship in the Kirov class, Frunze, was completed. She was assigned to the Pacific Fleet. In 1991, she was renamed Admiral Lazarev. The ship became inactive in 1994 and was decommissioned four years later.

Kalinin was the third Kirov-class ship to enter service, in 1988. She was also assigned to the Northern Fleet. Renamed to Admiral Nakhimov, the ship was mothballed in 1999 and reactivated in 2005.

Construction of the fourth ship, Yuri Andropov encountered many delays; her construction started in 1986 but wasn't completed until ten years later, in 1996, whereforth she was christened Pyotr Velikiy (Peter the Great). The ship has been declared the flagship of the Russian Northern Fleet.

On March 23, 2004, the Russian Northern Fleet Chief Commander, Admiral Vladimir Kuroedov said that Pyotr Velikiy's reactor was in an extremely bad condition and could explode "at any moment." This statement was later withdrawn and may have been the result of internal politics within the Russian Navy, as Admiral Igor Kasatonov (the uncle of Pyotr Velikiy commander Vladimir Kasatanov) was testifying in the court hearings on the loss of the K-159 and the Kursk disaster.

The ship was sent to port for a month, and the crew lost one-third of their pay. Examinations found no problems with the ship's reactor.

The fifth ship, to be known as Dzerzhinsky, also ran into delays. Her name was changed to October Revolution, and then Kuznetsov, and later scrapped while incomplete.
An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.
Sir Winston Churchill

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marcelo_malara
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Postby marcelo_malara » Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:15 am

Dzerzhinsky was the chief of the Tcheka, the political police in the first times after the October Revolution. Is there any antecedent of a ship named after such a bloody person?

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Postby Zaku II » Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:26 pm

This is the japanese response to Kirov.... :wink:

Image
As the battle goes on we feel stronger, how much longer must this go on.

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Re:

Postby tameraire01 » Sun Jul 20, 2014 10:06 pm

Coyote850 wrote:Can't answer all your questions. But it is my understanding that the Kirovs have been retired. They where great looking ships that packed a huge punch. But in the end they cost too much too keep active. It is my understanding that one of them(maybe Kirov)had a reactor accident and was put out of commision because it was too costly and dangerous to repair her.


Not quite they are planning for all four to be battle ready by 2020. Nothing in Natos arsenal would be able to stop them. ICBMs are useless against it due to the S-300FM missile. Only a submarine could have a chance a slim chance but a chance non the less.
Ideas are more powerful than guns. We would not let our enemies have guns, why should we let them have ideas. Joseph Stalin

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Re: Kirov Class Battlecruiser?

Postby Paul L » Wed Mar 25, 2015 4:59 am

According to the Seaforth naval review 2014 their is only one Kirow and another one laid up pending a long refit etc. It's not likely to be ready by 2020. Its only reason to exist is to escort the Kuznetsov CV and lead a SAG . There are 3 Slava that can escort a CV as well. A second one active would imply another future CV ? Or perhaps it anticipates escorting the Mistral Assault ships current being built for Russia?
"Eine mal is kein mal"

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Re: Kirov Class Battlecruiser?

Postby paul.mercer » Tue Mar 31, 2015 5:48 pm

Gentlemen,
What about a Kirov v updated Iowa class - one to one of course?


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