Naval History Forums

We cannot change history no matter how much we want too.

would they wait till kgv was in mothballs to invade?

As she could have been in 82 is she was still around.

tameraire01 wrote:would they wait till kgv was in mothballs to invade?

The reasons for the invasion were to do with Galtieri and the military in Argentina wanting to preserve their position, against a background of a failing protectionist economy.

Galtieri launched the invasion in the belief that Britain, in having a woman Prime Minister (Margaret Thatcher), would accept Argentine annexation and make no military counter measures. The gamble failed and it brought down the military junta.

The prospect of a strong resolute British defence would have made an invasion by the junta unthinkable.

Logically in reality all the junta had to do was to wait for HMS Endurance to be scrapped, with no replacement, and for the other British defence cuts to be made.
However the junta wasn't in a position to wait - their weakening position forced the issue, they had to act when they did.

Which ended badly for them. There will be another war in the south Atlantic soon which would be a great shame when there president is being idiotic.

Another war in the South Atlantic - on what evidence?

She keeps shouting about the falklands. She has tried to get allies to help invade them again.

Shouting about the Falklands isn't the same thing as what Galtieri did.

The shouting is for internal consumption, to boost her image as the economy falters. Argentina does not have the naval forces and full logistics to mount an invasion with the force that would be required to seize and hold them. Not even the threat of having an aircraft carrier. And any build up of force would be detected before it could strike.

I doubt that there would be any stomach in Argentina for another war over the Falklands and their president knows it. Shouting is all she has.

What is the launcher behind KGV's "B" turret? SAM or SSM?

Bob

They look like Exocet SSM launchers.

More to the point, if RN was stupid enough to keep KGV into the late 1970s they would never have left the secondaries as 8 twin 5.25" guns. The only real purpose of secondaries in such a role would be to make up for desperately poor AAA. The four SEACAT GWS 22 would help, but long before that- they should have dumped the 5.25" guns for Mk IV twin 4.5" guns or even the Mk 6 Twin 3"L70 AAA.

Paul L wrote:They look like Exocet SSM launchers.

More to the point, if RN was stupid enough to keep KGV into the late 1970s they would never have left the secondaries as 8 twin 5.25" guns. The only real purpose of secondaries in such a role would be to make up for desperately poor AAA. The four SEACAT GWS 22 would help, but long before that- they should have dumped the 5.25" guns for Mk IV twin 4.5" guns or even the Mk 6 Twin 3"L70 AAA.

The reason you would retain the 5.25" guns is for shore bombardment, the reason the ship is still around. The US battleships fired many thousands of rounds of 5" ammo in that role.

Steve Crandell wrote:

Paul L wrote:They look like Exocet SSM launchers.

More to the point, if RN was stupid enough to keep KGV into the late 1970s they would never have left the secondaries as 8 twin 5.25" guns. The only real purpose of secondaries in such a role would be to make up for desperately poor AAA. The four SEACAT GWS 22 would help, but long before that- they should have dumped the 5.25" guns for Mk IV twin 4.5" guns or even the Mk 6 Twin 3"L70 AAA.

The reason you would retain the 5.25" guns is for shore bombardment, the reason the ship is still around. The US battleships fired many thousands of rounds of 5" ammo in that role.

The reason you would keep the 14" guns would be for shore bombardment at standoff distance. The 4.5" gun can put more lb. per minute - down range than the 5.25"; which makes it better AAA, better anti shipping and better shore bombardment.

http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNBR_45-45_mk5.htm
http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNBR_525-50_mk1.htm

5.25" = 7-8 x 80lb = 560-640 lb/minute down range to 21km
4.5" = 12-24 x 55lb = 660-1320 lb/minute down range to 19km

There is no role for such a large and expensive warship to fill in RN anyway so they would not have had BB last that long. Much more to the point to have Lion or Tiger last until early 1980s and be sent down.

I'm aware that the RN didn't have justification for retaining a KGV in service. The hypothesis was "what if there was one?".

Note that the USN didn't replace the 5"/38s on the Iowas with 5"/54s because there wasn't enough financial justification to do that. The mounts and everything below them would all have to be replaced at great expense. Same thing with going from 5.25" to 4.5".

Gentlemen,
Obviously the Belgrano v a KGv would be no contest, but what if HMS Belfast was both seaworthy and battleworthy, would the better trained RN ship and crew prevail?

I would think they would, however there were two smaller escort ships accompanying Belgrano and they would have to be reckoned with as well.