Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

General naval discussions that don't fit within any specific time period or cover several issues.
herrmill
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:48 pm

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by herrmill » Wed Sep 17, 2008 12:32 pm

marcelo_malara wrote:Hi guys. Those still believing the crazy theory of the giant ships should read this page http://www.1421exposed.com/.

Regards
That link pertains to Menzies' theory of the Ming Fleet discovering America. I'd invite you to browse Amazon for the number of books on Zheng He & the Ming Fleet; I've read my share & recommend both Edward Dyers & Louise Leavthes' books.

Should you have the opportunity, I invite you should visit Nanjing's Baochuan Shipyard where you can learn a lot about Chinese shipbuilding skills that were at their zenith decades before Columbus' birth. This massive shipyard with its six huge slipways (drydocks) built a large percentage of the various ships that sailed in Zheng He's fleet. Living in Hangzhou, China a few kilometers from the site of a 7,500 boat discovery & having the pleasure of visiting Baochuan & several museums, I don't question that the Chinese were capable of building such massive ships during that period before Zhu De's successor closed the door to exploration & withdrew from the world.

Chuck

Image

Image

Image

Image

User avatar
marcelo_malara
Senior Member
Posts: 1072
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:14 pm
Location: buenos aires

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by marcelo_malara » Wed Sep 17, 2008 4:30 pm

Sorry Hermill. Until I read the detailed description of the construction technics and see the blueprints of the ships, I am sceptical that such a large ship could be built in those years, as I expressed in my previous posts. Moreover, no ship longer than about 75 m was ever built of wood alone (with the sole exception of the clipper Great Republic, which was about 100 m long). And last, did they jump to build those giants ships without an evolutianary path? How long were Chinese ships before Zheng He?

Regards

User avatar
Ulrich Rudofsky
Contributor & Translator
Posts: 844
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 9:16 pm
Location: State of New York

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by Ulrich Rudofsky » Wed Sep 17, 2008 9:41 pm

Most of the history surrounding these large Roman and Chinese ships built from wood and concrete is controversial. That is what I like about it so much. History is full of controversies, e.g., BISMARCK.
Ulrich

herrmill
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:48 pm

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by herrmill » Thu Sep 18, 2008 2:34 am

Not to tread on anyone's personal beliefs, but based on your requirements for proof, I would have to say that also discredits another famous ship that was measured in cubits... :wink:

In all seriousness, I tend to agree with Ulrich & believe that history is filled with controversy & challenges. Thats what makes it studying it so interesting.

User avatar
marcelo_malara
Senior Member
Posts: 1072
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:14 pm
Location: buenos aires

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by marcelo_malara » Thu Sep 18, 2008 3:12 am

I would have to say that also discredits another famous ship that was measured in cubits...
Which one?

User avatar
RF
Senior Member
Posts: 7514
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 1:15 pm
Location: Wolverhampton, ENGLAND

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by RF » Thu Sep 18, 2008 7:55 am

Nice pictures posted above.
''Give me a Ping and one Ping only'' - Sean Connery.

herrmill
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:48 pm

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by herrmill » Thu Sep 18, 2008 8:43 am

Thanks, that was from a visit to Baochuan in Oct '06. I have many more of the replica & surrounding area should anyone be interested. The yard has three slipways remaining of the original six; considering records show that over 10,000 workers were employed at Baochaun during this period, I don't think they were only making small fishing junks & paddle boats for the local waterways. Building the fleet & financing the exploration voyages came close to bankrupting the empire.

Here are some illustrations & photos of the ships that made up the fleet of large treasure ships, troop ships, horse ships, water & store ships & smaller escort or attack vessels. In addition to many other maritime innovations, it appears China should also be given credit for inventing the naval task force. The last two of the diorama are from Singapore's Zheng He Museum.

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Regarding that other famous boat, try reading Genesis, Chapter 6. :D

Chuck

User avatar
RF
Senior Member
Posts: 7514
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 1:15 pm
Location: Wolverhampton, ENGLAND

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by RF » Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:17 pm

Again nice pictures. Thanks for the post.
''Give me a Ping and one Ping only'' - Sean Connery.

User avatar
Ulrich Rudofsky
Contributor & Translator
Posts: 844
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 9:16 pm
Location: State of New York

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by Ulrich Rudofsky » Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:31 pm

I have posted some more photos of my newest versions of the 1:1250 Bao Chuan models at: http://ship1250photo.com/index.php?cat=10005


Treasure Ship/Schatzschiff
Image
Treasure Ship/Schatzschiff
Image
Ulrich

herrmill
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:48 pm

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by herrmill » Thu Sep 18, 2008 1:10 pm

Nice work! :clap:

User avatar
marcelo_malara
Senior Member
Posts: 1072
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:14 pm
Location: buenos aires

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by marcelo_malara » Thu Sep 18, 2008 2:09 pm

Regarding that other famous boat, try reading Genesis, Chapter 6.
Don´t worry, I don´t believe in that too!!!

herrmill
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:48 pm

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by herrmill » Thu Sep 18, 2008 2:24 pm

For those who doubt China's shipbuilding expertise, here are several models of Song Dynasty imperial barges that were found on Hangzhou's West Lake. Even Marco Polo was smitten in more ways than one.. :wink: with what he found in what was then the world's largest city. He called it the "City of Heaven" after having visited our locale at the end of the 13th century.

The wooden models are from a small museum in Xi Tang, a small water town that may be familiar for those who saw the movie Mission Impossible 3. The dragon boat is from a local museum here in Hangzhou & is the basis of a tour boat that one can cruise on West Lake today.

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

User avatar
Ulrich Rudofsky
Contributor & Translator
Posts: 844
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 9:16 pm
Location: State of New York

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by Ulrich Rudofsky » Thu Sep 18, 2008 4:25 pm

A very fine miniature 1:1250 model of a treasure ship is produced by Johann Wolkersdorfer (JW Model No. 057) and is part of a large series of historic ships. These are available in the USA from http://www.collectableships.com/models/HL%20&%20JW.htm and several dealers in Germany http://www.galerie-maritim.de/
Image
Image Image
Ulrich

bigboat1
Junior Member
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2010 2:59 am

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by bigboat1 » Mon Feb 08, 2010 3:03 am

The Cheng ho ship from Trumpeter is not 1/1250 but stated to be 1/250. It took a while to find this out but it is true The model is 2 feet long the original is said to be 400-450 feet long. :cool:

lwd
Senior Member
Posts: 3810
Joined: Sat Jun 17, 2006 2:15 am
Location: Southfield, USA

Re: Admiral Zheng He (Cheng Ho) treasure ship design

Post by lwd » Mon Feb 08, 2010 6:25 pm

You really should put credits on pictures when you post them. From the text I suspect these are yours but there's no harm in getting credit if someone else is an ehtical poster and it actually makes the photos more useful to researchers.

Post Reply