Optimum speeds for destroyers in gun battles

Guns, torpedoes, mines, bombs, missiles, ammunition, fire control, radars, and electronic warfare.
Byron Angel
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Re: Optimum speeds for destroyers in gun battles

Post by Byron Angel » Thu Dec 24, 2020 8:51 pm

Many of the destroyers mentioned in the March 42 entries of the Pearl Harbor dockyard diary had participated in the Feb 42 Gilbert-Marshalls raid, so it seems that ships were not being held back for lack of a radar outfit.

B

OpanaPointer
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Re: Optimum speeds for destroyers in gun battles

Post by OpanaPointer » Fri Dec 25, 2020 1:56 pm

Wondering if radar-equipped ships called target bearing for less well-endowed units?

dunmunro
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Location: Langley BC Canada

Re: Optimum speeds for destroyers in gun battles

Post by dunmunro » Fri Dec 25, 2020 9:08 pm

This is from:
New Eye for the Navy:
The Origin of Radar at the Naval Research Laboratory

Records do not show the exact situation on December 7, 1941. However, a complete survey of
what equipment had been installed and what delivered was made less than 2 weeks later. It was summarized in an internal memorandum of the Bureau of Ships written on December 20, 1941.

"The situation with respect to the Radar program as of 18 December
1941...appears to be progressing very satisfactorily considering some of
the early difficulties which had to be overcome....

The following table shows the extent to which deliveries and installa-
tion of shipboard equipment have been made as of 18 December 1941.

Type Sets Delivered - Sets Installed - Delivery Date
CXAM______6______________6__Completed
CXAM-1____14______________13_Completed
FA_________10______________9__Completed
FC_________49______________21_21 per week
SC_________48______________27_14 per week
SD__________5______________3__7 per week

____________132____________79"
So the above implies no production installation of FD radars.

From Rowland and Boyd's BuOrd in WW2:
While no ideal or complete solution to the varied problems was
produced during the war, considerable progress was made. Control
of 5-inch guns against aircraft was the first objective of the
program, and the Bell Telephone Laboratories were given the job
of modifying the Mark 3 for that purpose. To the functions of the
Mark 3 the derivation of elevation angle was added; lobe switching
in elevation, the same technique used to give the Mark 3 its accuracy
in azimuth, proved the answer. Except for a new antenna and
an additional indicator for the pointer, the new model, designated
the Radar Equipment Mark 4, was essentially the same as the
Mark 3. Late in September 1941, the first installation was made
in the destroyer Roe. Before the end of the year production
models were available for installation.

dunmunro
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Posts: 3983
Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2005 1:25 am
Location: Langley BC Canada

Re: Optimum speeds for destroyers in gun battles

Post by dunmunro » Fri Dec 25, 2020 9:40 pm

OpanaPointer wrote:
Fri Dec 25, 2020 1:56 pm
Wondering if radar-equipped ships called target bearing for less well-endowed units?
Sending range information would have been more useful since optical bearing accuracy was typically better than radar could provide.

Byron Angel
Senior Member
Posts: 1167
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 1:06 am

Re: Optimum speeds for destroyers in gun battles

Post by Byron Angel » Sat Dec 26, 2020 3:34 am

dunmunro wrote:
Fri Dec 25, 2020 9:08 pm
This is from:
New Eye for the Navy:
The Origin of Radar at the Naval Research Laboratory

Records do not show the exact situation on December 7, 1941. However, a complete survey of
what equipment had been installed and what delivered was made less than 2 weeks later. It was summarized in an internal memorandum of the Bureau of Ships written on December 20, 1941.

"The situation with respect to the Radar program as of 18 December
1941...appears to be progressing very satisfactorily considering some of
the early difficulties which had to be overcome....

The following table shows the extent to which deliveries and installa-
tion of shipboard equipment have been made as of 18 December 1941.

Type Sets Delivered - Sets Installed - Delivery Date
CXAM______6______________6__Completed
CXAM-1____14______________13_Completed
FA_________10______________9__Completed
FC_________49______________21_21 per week
SC_________48______________27_14 per week
SD__________5______________3__7 per week

____________132____________79"
So the above implies no production installation of FD radars.

From Rowland and Boyd's BuOrd in WW2:
While no ideal or complete solution to the varied problems was
produced during the war, considerable progress was made. Control
of 5-inch guns against aircraft was the first objective of the
program, and the Bell Telephone Laboratories were given the job
of modifying the Mark 3 for that purpose. To the functions of the
Mark 3 the derivation of elevation angle was added; lobe switching
in elevation, the same technique used to give the Mark 3 its accuracy
in azimuth, proved the answer. Except for a new antenna and
an additional indicator for the pointer, the new model, designated
the Radar Equipment Mark 4, was essentially the same as the
Mark 3. Late in September 1941, the first installation was made
in the destroyer Roe. Before the end of the year production
models were available for installation.

The above is not inconsistent with the Bell Labs document, whose mention of production dates should not realistically be interpreted as delivery or installation dates.

The Pearl Harbor dockyard diary, with data for the months Dec41 through Feb42 missing, can cast little light on the matter. The earliest FD installation which survives in that document was USS Reid DD369 on 02 Mar 42.

Trust you are having a happy Christmas/Boxing Day weekend.

B

dunmunro
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Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2005 1:25 am
Location: Langley BC Canada

Re: Optimum speeds for destroyers in gun battles

Post by dunmunro » Sat Dec 26, 2020 4:25 am

Byron Angel wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 3:34 am




Trust you are having a happy Christmas/Boxing Day weekend.

B
Yes, thanks, and I hope you are too.

cheers and Merry Christmas.

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