Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

From the Washington Naval Treaty to the end of the Second World War.
jrsteven00
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Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by jrsteven00 »

I've got a challenge.
What are the best unknown stories from World War II?
I'm particularly interested navy stories.

I'm referring to stories like Hampton Side's book "Ghost Soldiers" about the Ranger raid on the Cabanatuan POW camp in the Philippines. Few people knew about that story until he wrote that book. Sides discovered the tale while talking to WW2 veterans at the VFW hall where he lives in Santa Fe, NM. Or the fight by Taffy 3's jeep carriers and DE's to turn back the Japanese battlefleet at Leyte Gulf-- described in James D. Hornfischer's "The Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors." And the mystery of what happened between the HMAs Sydney and KMS Kormorran off the west coast of Australia.

Are there other unknown stories lurking out there? I'm an American, but I earned a masters degree in WW2 British battleships at the Univ. of Edinburgh, so I'm also interested on Royal Navy stories.
Why am I asking?
I'm a writer looking for unknown stories to pitch as article and book proposals. After a several year break from writing about naval history, I want to get back to this topic.

Please post any names, leads, fragments or rumors that you’ve heard or read. There’s still so much WW2 history that needs to be told.

Thanks,
J. Stevenson
lwd
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by lwd »

The battle off Samar is hardly unknown. If you are looking into the nooks and crannys Google "Greenland Patrol" and/or "German weather station arctic". Again not unknown but certainly not widely known. There's also a book out I believe on the fairly regular flights from Britain to Sweden during the war. Not sure if I'd know much if anything about these if I didn't have relatives involved.
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

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jrsteven00
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by jrsteven00 »

Thanks for these tips. I've heard of those examples, but only vaguely. So they are good to explore more.
Now I just need to discover if American readers are willing to buy books about the Royal Navy?
-JS
lwd
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by lwd »

I suspect the Americans on this board are not typical as to their willingness to buy books on any naval subject.
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by Olaf »

Please forgive my ignorance, but what is an MA degree in "WWII British Battleships"? I've heart that there might be a course to study for everything, but what exactly were they teaching you? What was the requirement for this? A BA degree in Heavy Cruisers? :think:

Happy modelling ~ Olaf!
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lwd
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by lwd »

Another area that is little know is the naval war in the Baltic. In particular the Finnish Soviet aspects. Although they may be well known in Finland. Some of the events in the Med are also less well known at least in the US.
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RF
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by RF »

lwd wrote:The battle off Samar is hardly unknown. If you are looking into the nooks and crannys Google "Greenland Patrol" and/or "German weather station arctic". Again not unknown but certainly not widely known. There's also a book out I believe on the fairly regular flights from Britain to Sweden during the war. Not sure if I'd know much if anything about these if I didn't have relatives involved.
Another ''unknown'' aspect of WW2 were German guerilla operations, the landing of agents in places including South Africa and the USA by U-boat to conduct campaigns of industrial sabotage. These remain largely unknown partly due to their complete failure to inflict any damage.
Even succesful campaigns, such as that of the hilfskruezer, are still not widely known.

Neither was the war in East Africa given that much attention.....even less the naval aspects of it.
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marcelo_malara
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by marcelo_malara »

Do you know about the German subs sent by train to the Black Sea?

Regards
lwd
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by lwd »

I think I've heard of them but that's about it. As far as the Med goes there is a fair amount of info available but most of it from the British POV and often lacking context for Italian actions. I do remember reading recently some acounts for instance of several actions vs Italian destroyers around Crete which emphasised the bravery and skill of the Italian crews. However I've read little to put them in context. The same is true of some of the Italian special units. Their successes may be mentioned and with some admiration but the vew point tends to be British.
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RF
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by RF »

The Italian Navy was good at small scale operations, for example their ''chariot'' attack on Alexandria is well known and was successful. There is very little info on a later planned operation, using this form of attack, on New York harbour aimed at sinking merchant ships at anchor - for logistical reasons the attack never got beyond initial planning, not least because the Italians didn't want the Germans to be involved.
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aurora
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by aurora »

Not quite New York RF but still a bold move

Gibraltar was very tempting to the Italians for their safe shelter of British warships and allied merchant shipping The Italian frogmen originally used a Spanish villa that was located 2 miles from Gibraltar. It was owned by an Italian officer married to a Spanish woman named Conchita Ramognino. This villa held the frogmen who would sneak out into the harbour and attack unsuspecting British warships. But this proved very difficult and costly. The harbour was very well protected by netting, patrol boats and search lights.

Because of this difficulty, the Italians decided to use a battered Italian merchant ship docked across the bay of Gibraltar. It was the 4,995 ton Olterra. Italian frogmen secretly replaced the crew with divers and technicians and built a workshop to house, build and maintain human torpedoes. A door was then cut 6 feet below the surface to allow these 2-man human torpedoes to come and go undetected. Replacement torpedoes were shipped from Italy disguised as boiler tubes.

When the Italian frogmen commenced their attacks on British warships from this location, it proved just as costly. Five out of six frogmen never returned. But when the Italians decided to attack the merchant shipping, which was less protected, they were rewarded with easy prey. Italian frogmen sank or damaged a total of 42,000 tons of Allied shipping. The British never did find out where these frogmen came from or where they had gone.
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Jim
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RF
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by RF »

Just as well for the Spanish.

Had they colluded or even acquiesced it would be an outright breach of neutrality.
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aurora
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by aurora »

Both the Spanish and British were supposedly deceived; but I think there had to be a degree of acquiescence by the Spanish; but of that I am not at all sure RF
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Jim
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Re: Best unknown tales from WW2 naval history

Post by Dod Grile »

Many actions in the NEI campaign (Dec. 1941--Mar '42) were extremely mysterious and some remains so to this day, including the sinking of USS Edsall (DD-219) , the sinking of USS Pillsbury (DD-227), and the sinking of USS Asheville (PG-21) . We know more now about these than we did just 5-6 years ago, but there are still important questions that have not been answered fully.
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