ufo wrote:...like it or not – killing people is less acceptable nowadays....Looking at the history of the late 20th and early 21 century I'm not sure that is supportable. While some have an aversion to it others certainly do not.
...If you want to have peace … buy peace.Actually history teaches pretty much the opposite. If you buy peace you only buy it for a short term. Unless you can fix the underlying problems the conflict will be back in full measure.
After that one ended the Americans decided to simply buy peace and rewarded the Germans with everything from care-parcel to Marshall Plan.That's a bit of a misstatement of both the Marshap plan and the situtation at the time.
...Lasting peace costs investment not weapons.The European peace after WWII was at least in part due as much to nuclear weapons as economics.
What do you think you will achieve by blasting some fishing vessels on shore? Someone will build new ones..But they will also have to finance the new weapons and find will crew. As the profits decline and the risk increase this becomes a loosing proposition
And while they are building them someone will have the bright idea of packing a child's corpse into one of the vessels you just blasted, take pictures and the Do-gooder press will nail your fleece to the doors..That assumes they are around to do the photos. It's also pretty easy to tell a recent corpse from an old one.
... And for every innocent soul butchered you breed eleven more desperate men willing to go to sea. It will never end. It is in fact the same sad reason why we will loose the Afghan war..Actually just the opposite. The people know who is responsible for acts like this and it isn't the west.
That's why we're winning in Iraq and in the greater war on terror.
Q-sips are certainly an option. They work out at sea where collateral damage is hard to do. But they only nip the tip, they do not root out the problem...But they can. They make it no longer cost effective.
For attacking pirates at shore – let's be honest: there are parts of Houston where robberies are more common than elsewhere. No one yet suggested solving the problem by carpet bombing Houston.
No! No! Now why is that different?!Perhaps becuase there is a rule of law functioning there. That's a completely different situation from Somalia.
[/quote]If these days you hit the innocent you campaign is doomed...That depends on a bunch of factors.
ufo wrote:...If you want to have peace … buy peace.
Actually history teaches pretty much the opposite. If you buy peace you only buy it for a short term. Unless you can fix the underlying problems the conflict will be back in full measure.
I am happy to take examples! I can not think of a case where a nation that after a successful campaign invested money and politics in a region did not get stability as a reward.
The European peace after WWII was at least in part due as much to nuclear weapons as economics.
True. But a policy of deterrent needs an inteligent enemy with something to loose. The problem with piracy is entirely different. The ones reaping the benefits are not the perpetrators. The ones who get the lion shares of the ransons for vessels do not care a bit if the whole of Somalia is blasted away to widen the entrance to the Suez.
.... For those who pull the strings the crews are entirely expendable.
.... The military only cures the symptoms.
...This kind of war is not about the truth. This is fought on the front pages and if you bring in a dementy with a long winded statement from a pathologist the day after tomorrow you have lost it allready on the home front.
Actually just the opposite. The people know who is responsible for acts like this and it isn't the west.
I think this overestimates the amount of free information in parts of the world.
But they can. They make it no longer cost effective.
A fishing vessel with rocket propelled granades and few desperate men costs peanuts. This is organized and for those organizing it the loss of one vessel costs near to nothing. A successful operation yields millions of Pounds.
...Then let us bring law to Somalia not war.
...One day a Soviet frighter had a dead man hanging from its bridge wing. There was never again an attack on a vessel flying the red banner. Civilized? Justified? It worked! It is just barbaric!
Even thirty years ago a British or American captain could not have done that. He would in the end have gone to jail for the lynching. ...
hammy wrote:1 ) Under international maritime law Pirates are "Enemies of all mankind" . Stop pussyfooting around and HANG THE BASTARDS ! !
Honestly . The entire worlds navies have got squat-all to do at the moment except polish their tompions , and we cant even sort out a few boatfulls of homicidal savages with AK 47s , and a few RPGs and the odd Machine gun . Bloody Pathetic ! !
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